The PrivacyPapers was released over a two week period of emails by Michael Kasdan, who has generously given us permission to post it in its entirety over several posts.
You can search Twitter: #PrivacyPapers, for the content and to share comments.
26. Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
From: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com [privacy-papers@googlegroups.com] on behalf of Michael Kasdan [mkasdan@ARELAW.com]
Sent: Sunday, September 01, 2013
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Doc Searls Weblog · Thoughts on privacy
#andDOWNthestretchwecome
Some food for thought. Very interesting read, I thought.
Especially the part about physical world privacy vs. digital and the differences.
Also last night I was thinking about books and movies about distopian futures and in particular about the future world depicted in Cloud Atlas, a corpocracy where corporations rule and people are reduced to mere “consumers.”
I don’t consider myself to be alarmist, and I think I have a pretty good grasp and appreciation for the amazing and powerful benefits that social media and big data can provide.
But I’m also very very scared.
(And yes, I realize that I haven’t answered Question No. 3).
Best, Mike
From: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com [privacy-papers@googlegroups.com] on behalf of Michael Kasdan [mkasdan@ARELAW.com] Sent: Monday, September 02, 2013
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
Hope everyone has had a nice long weekend holiday. We’ve now gone two weeks with this endeavor, and I’ve had a blast scratching at the surface of this interesting and difficult issue.
Time for everyone’s closing thoughts, feelings, predictions, fears, desires . . . when you get a chance. . . .
All my best,
Mike
From: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com [mailto:privacy-papers@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Kasdan
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2013
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
Alright, alright….I was kidding about the tidy bow. 🙂
But I will take any closing thoughts that anyone has to offer.
For otherwise,
This is the way the #PrivacyPapers ends.
This is the way the #PrivacyPapers ends.
Not with a bang, but a whimper.
(http://www.artofeurope.com/eliot/eli2.htm)
From: John
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2013 9:36 AM
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
My closing thought – thanks, Michael, for putting together the group and doing such a great job moderating.
Thanks to all for your great insights.
From: Lisa
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2013 2:14 PM
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
I’ll echo John’s closing. Thanks for moderating a lively discussion Mike. Privacy was not at the forefront of my thinking, but now I see it, or its lack, everywhere. And I don’t see a healthy trend; not towards clear disclosure on the part of digital providers, nor from consumers demanding, understanding or exercising their rights. As the one article you posted said, privacy was /is achieved by physical barriers in the real world. What is their digital equivalent? And, humans have always sold their own stories for economic gain or otherwise. But they usually had clarity and control about to whom, for how long and in what form. My god, digital UnPrivacy is making Copyright laws seem admirable!
From: Sanjay
Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 2:18 AM
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
I’ve really enjoyed reading all of your thoughts and opinions. I just read an article that I had to share.
I’m all for the concept of Big Data Ethics and am inspired to make sure that my new venture thinks it through!
On Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 6:55 AM, John Havens <johnchavens@gmail.com> wrote:
That’s a great article. Thanks for sending.
From: Brian
Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 11:10 AM
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
I do think there is hope for a better world one day where every child will have the ability to control their own privacy – oh, wait, I just saw this. My favorite line was “At the same time, Facebook made it more complicated to opt out.”
But I don’t want to point out what Facebook is trying to do. I want to point out that they are delaying their changes because of public backlash. I personally think that the way we are going to “fix” privacy is to educate the consumers. The more educated consumers are, the less likely companies are going to try and sneak one by. Companies (well at least some) are starting to realize that they need their customers trust. From what I’ve seen, there is a movement in the industry to be more protective of consumers privacy. Twitter used to be the lone company pushing back on government requests for data. Now more and more companies are on board. Companies are trying to come up with ways to make it clear to their users what data is collected and shared (though the fear of frivolous lawsuits still requires us all to have legalese versions of our privacy policies). For example, a new fitness app from www.Human.co allows users to request the data that the app has collected on them.
But while I have hope that industry will change because consumers will require it, I’m totally freaked out about what the government has been up to. I’m all for protecting the US, but hacking into systems is going too far. Hopefully public backlash will have positive effects on the government’s collection and use of data as well.
From: Bill
Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 11:33 PM
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
Here is where I would put my profound statement on what we’ve accomplished and figured out via this discussion and how we could move forward and achieve this goal. But I got nothing. Seriously, I understand things even less after this discussion. I’m still optimistic about our privacy with 3rd parties (ie. other companies), but scared out of my wits about the government spying on it’s own citizens.
From: TheModVillage
Sent: Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 11:37 PM
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
http://www.magellanmediapartners.com/index.php/mmcp/article/nothing_to_hide/
And it’s not necessary to add this, but Brian writes on privacy (and piracy) and I thought this was an interesting piece, ESP the link to Allistair Croll’s piece.
Croll’s piece is worth posting to PP, if you like.
Lisa
From: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com [mailto:privacy-papers@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Kasdan
Sent: Saturday, September 07, 2013
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
So basically, what you’re saying is: “I award you no points. And may God have mercy on our souls.”
🙂
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Doc Searls Weblog · Thoughts on privacy
#andDOWNthestretchwecome
Some food for thought. Very interesting read, I thought.
Especially the part about physical world privacy vs. digital and the differences.
Also last night I was thinking about books and movies about distopian futures and in particular about the future world depicted in Cloud Atlas, a corpocracy where corporations rule and people are reduced to mere “consumers.”
I don’t consider myself to be alarmist, and I think I have a pretty good grasp and appreciation for the amazing and powerful benefits that social media and big data can provide.
But I’m also very very scared.
(And yes, I realize that I haven’t answered Question No. 3).
Best, Mike
From: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com [privacy-papers@googlegroups.com] on behalf of Michael Kasdan [mkasdan@ARELAW.com] Sent: Monday, September 02, 2013
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
Hope everyone has had a nice long weekend holiday. We’ve now gone two weeks with this endeavor, and I’ve had a blast scratching at the surface of this interesting and difficult issue.
Time for everyone’s closing thoughts, feelings, predictions, fears, desires . . . when you get a chance. . . .
All my best,
Mike
From: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com [mailto:privacy-papers@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Kasdan
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2013
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
Alright, alright….I was kidding about the tidy bow. 🙂
But I will take any closing thoughts that anyone has to offer.
For otherwise,
This is the way the #PrivacyPapers ends.
This is the way the #PrivacyPapers ends.
Not with a bang, but a whimper.
(http://www.artofeurope.com/eliot/eli2.htm)
From: John
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2013 9:36 AM
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
My closing thought – thanks, Michael, for putting together the group and doing such a great job moderating.
Thanks to all for your great insights.
From: Lisa
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2013 2:14 PM
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
I’ll echo John’s closing. Thanks for moderating a lively discussion Mike. Privacy was not at the forefront of my thinking, but now I see it, or its lack, everywhere. And I don’t see a healthy trend; not towards clear disclosure on the part of digital providers, nor from consumers demanding, understanding or exercising their rights. As the one article you posted said, privacy was /is achieved by physical barriers in the real world. What is their digital equivalent? And, humans have always sold their own stories for economic gain or otherwise. But they usually had clarity and control about to whom, for how long and in what form. My god, digital UnPrivacy is making Copyright laws seem admirable!
From: Sanjay
Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 2:18 AM
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
I’ve really enjoyed reading all of your thoughts and opinions. I just read an article that I had to share.
I’m all for the concept of Big Data Ethics and am inspired to make sure that my new venture thinks it through!
On Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 6:55 AM, John Havens <johnchavens@gmail.com> wrote:
That’s a great article. Thanks for sending.
From: Brian
Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 11:10 AM
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
I do think there is hope for a better world one day where every child will have the ability to control their own privacy – oh, wait, I just saw this. My favorite line was “At the same time, Facebook made it more complicated to opt out.”
But I don’t want to point out what Facebook is trying to do. I want to point out that they are delaying their changes because of public backlash. I personally think that the way we are going to “fix” privacy is to educate the consumers. The more educated consumers are, the less likely companies are going to try and sneak one by. Companies (well at least some) are starting to realize that they need their customers trust. From what I’ve seen, there is a movement in the industry to be more protective of consumers privacy. Twitter used to be the lone company pushing back on government requests for data. Now more and more companies are on board. Companies are trying to come up with ways to make it clear to their users what data is collected and shared (though the fear of frivolous lawsuits still requires us all to have legalese versions of our privacy policies). For example, a new fitness app from www.Human.co allows users to request the data that the app has collected on them.
But while I have hope that industry will change because consumers will require it, I’m totally freaked out about what the government has been up to. I’m all for protecting the US, but hacking into systems is going too far. Hopefully public backlash will have positive effects on the government’s collection and use of data as well.
From: Bill
Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 11:33 PM
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
Here is where I would put my profound statement on what we’ve accomplished and figured out via this discussion and how we could move forward and achieve this goal. But I got nothing. Seriously, I understand things even less after this discussion. I’m still optimistic about our privacy with 3rd parties (ie. other companies), but scared out of my wits about the government spying on it’s own citizens.
From: TheModVillage
Sent: Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 11:37 PM
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
http://www.magellanmediapartners.com/index.php/mmcp/article/nothing_to_hide/
And it’s not necessary to add this, but Brian writes on privacy (and piracy) and I thought this was an interesting piece, ESP the link to Allistair Croll’s piece.
Croll’s piece is worth posting to PP, if you like.
Lisa
From: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com [mailto:privacy-papers@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Kasdan
Sent: Saturday, September 07, 2013
To: privacy-papers@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: #Privacy Papers – Wrapping Things Up with a Tidy Bow
So basically, what you’re saying is: “I award you no points. And may God have mercy on our souls.”
🙂
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